Hi,

I'm moving in to a brand new housing estate this week and I currently own a 7402VGO.

The new estate has fibre optic connection to each household, and the ISP is called E-wire.

I've been advised that there is no cable modem as such required to make a connection. It's simply an RJ45 network socket in the wall which for example can be connected directly to a Windows XP PC and a simple PPPoE connection is made using the built in Windows stuff.

I've also been advised that many customers of theirs use routers, for example a straight up "Broadband wireless router" that is capible of making a PPPoE session will work too.

What i'm wanting to know is; will my 7402VGO freak out because it can't detect any line sync, or is there any way to tell it to just go ahead and try to initiate a PPPoE session using one of the built in Ethernet ports?

I'm not worried if I need to telnet in to it or make some radical changes to firmware, but I just want to know if I can save myself the hassle of having to buy an entire new router.

We also will have no phone connected straight away so were planning to use VoIP, meaning i'd have to buy an ATA as well :(

I'm going to test this theory tonight at home by unplugging the telephone socket and messing about with the settings, but just wanted to see if anyone else had managed to do this before in the past.

I've also posted this on the Billion forums.

Thanks for your help in advance... if anyone can help that is!

Bonezﮱ writes...

will my 7402VGO freak out because it can't detect any line sync, or is there any way to tell it to just go ahead and try to initiate a PPPoE session using one of the built in Ethernet ports?


You can create VLAN on the billion, however I don't believe you can start the pppoe process on something other than the dsl interface.

You will need a proper router for this with a WAN interface. Linksys WRT54GL is your best best

The 7402VGO WAN port is the ADSL connection, so you won't be able to use it.
You need a router.

Bonezﮱ writes...

We also will have no phone connected straight away so were planning to use VoIP, meaning i'd have to buy an ATA as well

Then you could look at the Billion 6404, but it cannot be a VPN endpoint like the VGO.
Are you currently using or have plans to use the router as a VPN endpoint?

A Linksys WRT54GL or Buffalo WHR-G54S with dd-wrt firmware would do, but they do not act as an ATA, so you would still be looking at an additional box for that function.

I have used a Draytek 2900VG which is a router that can act as a VPN endpoint, and has a VoIP ATA all in one, but having used a Billion 7402VGO for VoIP, I was very disappointed with it in regard to dial plans.

Thanks for the replies. No, I don't currently use the VPN functionality even though i'm aware it is available in the VGO series.

A VGP would suit me fine, but the next problem is - i'm planning on switching back to ADSL once the 6 months free internet offer with this cable ISP expires (It was included when we purchased the block of land).

I think for a real tight ass solution, i'm going to have to get an old PC, set up a linux box router with a USB wireless card (which I have laying around already) and make my own wireless access point to use with other devices in the house, and secondly, buy a cheap ATA from eBay and use that for phone calls.

I have a 10/100 switch laying around somewhere too. Does it make sense what i'm saying?

Easy solution: Go spend $150 and buy a 6404VGP
Poor first home buyer broke no money solution:

Old P4 computer with linux and a USB wireless card.
Connect the old P4 computer into a 5 port 10/100 switch, connect the internet/wall socket into the switch, connect my normal wired Windows Desktop PC into the network switch also. Make the linux box a DHCP server, internet gateway etc for all other devices.

Plug cheap VoIP ATA into network switch.

Let the Linux box handle the PPPoE session and share it out via the USB wireless device to other laptops and PDA's in the house.

Sound do-able?
:)

It's been a while since I was playing with Linux firewalls, but USB support was difficult - it may be much better now.
Other than that - you should be OK.

I'm assuming you already have the P4.

You'll probably find the running cost of the P4 (electricity) over 6 months x 24hrs will come close to the price of the 6404VGP.

I have a 6404VGP and very happy with it, using with a separate ADSL modem (which you could also do later if required). You can get a good deal on them from MyNetFone since you're looking for VoIP too, although I got mine on ebay.

Edit: quick back-of-the-envelope calculation assuming a conservative 100W draw for a low power P4
0.1kW * 24 hrs * 30 days * 6 months * 17c per kW/h = about $75

The 6404 draws less than 10W

although perhaps you'll only run the P4 when needed, but that sucks for convenience... go the router.

Bonezﮱ writes...

Easy solution: Go spend $150 and buy a 6404VGP

Sell the 7404VGO on ebay.
Buy the 6404VGP.

And in 6 month buy a TPLink 8810 for $40 ...
Will do just as much as your current 7404 if not better (the broadcom chipset in TP-Link are excellent)

That's provided you were happy with the billion.

Personally I use the Linksys with a SPA-3000 ATA, it's much more features and doesn't cost much more than the billion

Telnet your router LAN IP (login same credentials as web) and try these CLI commands ...

transports delete wanlink

port ethernet set p1vlanmember 0x7
port ethernet set p2vlanmember 0x7
port ethernet set p3vlanmember 0x7
port ethernet set p4vlanmember 0x8

port ethernet set vlan enabled

port ethernet set switchreset true

pppoe add transport wanlink dialout eth 1 ethernet1
pppoe set transport wanlink username <username>
pppoe set transport wanlink password <passwd>

ip attach ipwan wanlink

system config save

system restart

NOTE: Only tested on 7401 so may need some adaptation for 7402 (vlanmember ids). Basically it disconnect the logical wan interface from the ADSL port, puts Ethernet port 4 on a seperate VLAN then re-associates wan inf with Ethernet 4 (over which it will do PPPoE).

Worth a shot.

Roman4604 writes...

Worth a shot.

Pretty nifty Roman4604. How have u tested this? Have you put the Billion behind an adsl modem and gotten it to login via pppoe. Does qos (and throttling) still work between the new wan interface(old lan port 4) and the other lan ports.

edit: your dialout string has no PVC parameter so I guess a connection over adsl wouldn't be possible. Still interested in qos and throttling though.

Tender Loins Ad writes...

How have u tested this? Have you put the Billion behind an adsl modem and gotten it to login via pppoe.

Actually have tested with iBurst modem & Alvarion WiMAX CPE.

Does qos (and throttling) still work between the new wan interface(old lan port 4) and the other lan ports.

From what I've seen & tested, all functionality that's bound to the logical wan interface still operates as normal (e.g. Firewall, VoIP etc.). Havent really tested QoS but dont see why it shouldn't?

your dialout string has no PVC parameter so I guess a connection over adsl wouldn't be possible

Not sure, didnt see any point in testing DSL. One word of warning, dont submit the wanlink web interface page, you'll see some fields have garbage in them, dont try rectify, the router goes a bit bezerk.

Roman4604 writes...

Telnet your router LAN IP (login same credentials as web) and try these CLI commands ...

I gave it a shot, but unfortunately could not get it to go :(
I tried exploring some of the commands (port, ethernet, pppoe) to see what other options were available also but was unable to get it going.

The interesting thing is, the 7402VGO only has 3 LAN ports. Does this kind of screw up the whole port config as per your post above?

I tried making p3vlanmember 0x8 and p1/p2 0x7 as well as a few other variations but it was a no go.

Anyone made this work on a 7402?

Cheers,
Bonez

Bonezﮱ writes...

The interesting thing is, the 7402VGO only has 3 LAN ports. Does this kind of screw up the whole port config as per your post above?

My guess is that as soon you have configured the billion with the CLI as mentioned above, you shouldn't ever use the web interface to configure your modem

Bonezﮱ writes...

I tried making p3vlanmember 0x8 and p1/p2 0x7 as well as a few other variations but it was a no go.

I'm pretty sure its the vlanmember setting that causing your probelms. I've noticed that different models use different ids.

Different way around this ...

Go to Bridge Interface (under LAN) on the web inf and move the tick on P3 to ethernet1 (one below).

Then telnet into the unit and type the following ...

port ethernet show

About halfway down you will see 3 pXvlanmember = YY note these down and modify the commands I posted to match.

Roman4604,

Thank you SO much for your assistance.

I got it all working this afternoon and these are the commands I ended up using:

transports delete wanlink
port ethernet set p1vlanmember 0x11
port ethernet set p2vlanmember 0x11
port ethernet set p3vlanmember 0x4
port ethernet set vlan enabled
port ethernet set switchreset true
pppoe add transport wanlink dialout eth 1 ethernet1
pppoe set transport wanlink username <username@isp.com.au>
pppoe set transport wanlink password <password>
ip attach ipwan wanlink
system config save
system restart

Will this reassign VPN functionality as well?

Guys

found this thread and found it most interesting. The idea of "converting the unit to a router only with PPP0E functions for things like wireless in the future sounds great.

Trying to get my head arround this.

>>>>Then telnet into the unit and type the following ...<<<<

Can you explain what this means to a newbie and how to do it. I have followed the basic instructions but dont know this bit.

Thanks

Hi Craftbrewer.

Thanks for your whim.

First of all I need to know which OS you are running. If you are running XP then you are in luck. It comes with a built in Telnet client. If you are running Vista, it's a little more tricky because you will need to install telnet (it comes with it, but just not by default).

Ok, so i'm going to assume that you are running XP.

Click the Start menu, then click on Run.

In the box, type in:

telnet 192.168.1.254
(i'm assuming this is the IP of your modem, if not, then change accordingly).

It will pop up with a prompt asking for your user name and password. Enter the same details that you would normally use when accessing the web interface.

Just for a bit of extra detail, telnet is an old school application that goes right back to the very early days of the internet. It runs over very slow connections - it's quick, dirty and text based. In our case here, it's just an alternative way of accessing the router.

Once you have logged in, simply copy and paste the lines I posted above. You can do this one at a time (probably safest if you aren't familiar with telnet) or in one big batch if you feel confident.

Before you go copying and pasting, open up Notepad and copy/paste everything from my post above into it.

Modify the username and password as required. Make sure you remove the < > from the username, I put that there just to show that you need to change it.

Now, once you have completed all of the commands, plug a LAN cable from port 3 on the router into your wall socket/cable modem/whatever it is that you are using.

Don't worry about the ADSL light - it will keep flashing forever until it detects line sync (which it will never do if you don't have an active ADSL service on your phone line!)

Log in to the web config by visiting 192.168.1.254

You should notice on the main page that it shows the router as having no ADSL sync however it should show your current WAN IP address - you should now be connected to the internet.

If you need any more help please post back or whim me and i'll be more than happy to help out.

Cheers
Bonez

Would this work for a 7402VGP ?

mate, hate to tell you this BUT I am running Vista, so any help there would be great

>>>>>Would this work for a 7402VGP ?<<<<<

Thats my model that I am playing with. I want to be able to use it as a router if I use a different internet mode, ie wireless.

Craftbrewer

Telenet and Vista, well problem solved.

this link explains it nicely

www.mydigitallife.info/2...-client-in-vista

Telnet is not installed with Windows Vista. The following guided tutorial will install Telnet client in Vista.

Click on Start button, then go to Control Panel -> Programs.
Under the Programs and Features section, click Turn Windows features on or off. If User Account Control permission confirmation request warning pops up, click on Continue. If you are prompted for an administrator password, type the password.
In the Windows Features dialog box, select (tick) the Telnet Client check box.
Click OK. Wait for the installation to finish.
Once installed, you can find Telnet Client by typing Telnet in Start Search.

Craftbrewer

Just tried this, and its BRILLIANT. Works on 7402VGP. I suspect this would work on any ADSL gateway with the right codes (and that is easy to find).

This means a ADSL gateway CAN be made into a router for other connections if you so desire down the line.

Two things.
1. This should be pinned somewhere (like on the Billion site) for all to see and use.

2. If Billion people are watching, why cant this feature be included in ALL ADSL firmware upgrades for these models, so it can done via the interface, instead of us having to manually do so.

Craftbrewer

I knew that Internode was setting up 7402 gear like this for their wireless ADSL setups; but Billion wouldn't give me details on how to do it and Internode "was not allowed"..... :(

Also the 6404VGP was touted as the replacement option, which is fine if you don't need VPN capability. Actually Billion did their own trials on a VPN version of the 6404VGP, but they never moved further with that product option.

Craftbrewer writes...

Just tried this, and its BRILLIANT. Works on 7402VGP. I suspect this would work on any ADSL gateway with the right codes (and that is easy to find).

Excellent, I am going to do it to my VGP then, and route my VOIP over my Cable.

Yeah - basically it can be done and it DOES work, but Billion does not want you to know that.

They want you to buy a 6404. Unfortunately I couldn't afford to do that, so I kept looking. I found what I was looking for eventually, and I hope that everyone else in this position comes across this thread!

Cheers
Bonez

The title of the thread I think is misleading, so might not be found by most.

What are the thoughts of a NEW thread with a summary of the procedures. I am happy to do it.

Something like "Converting Billion ADSL Gateways to an Internet Router"

Thoughts??????

Craftbrewer writes...

If Billion people are watching, why cant this feature be included in ALL ADSL firmware upgrades for these models, so it can done via the interface, instead of us having to manually do so.

Yeah, I've been lobbying Billion to do this on their 74XX range (premium) for quite a while, inc. full Web inf integation (Quick Start & WAN options), port labling etc.

In world where going forward DSL wont be such a defacto access option with FTTP, cable, WiMAX etc. on their way, I think buyers could be swayed into purchasing a CPE device that wont lock them into a particular access technology.

If Billion really pushed this aspect in their marketing they could get a decent 'one up' on their competitors.

Should I be able to get this to work with Optus cable?

My D-Link router bit the dust recently. I have a 7404VGO-M from a previous installation but haven't been able to get things up and running using the above instructions. I'd love to be able to use VoIP and play around with VPN using this and the cable conneciton.

My current cable modem is a Surfboard SB5101i.

Not familiar with Optus cable, but if it uses PPPoE it should. Otherwise refer to /forum-replies.cfm?t=967224 for non-PPPoE.

Roman4604 writes...

familiar with Optus cable,

Great contribution Roman. For Optus, the OP would need a DHCP client on the WAN interface, corresponding to the second of your two configs in the link in your post.

Don't forget that an Optus cable modem will 'remember' the MAC address of the last attached device. It may help to turn off the cable modem for a little while and turn it back on so that you can attach it to a new device.

Thanks all for the advice. I shall give it a go as soon as life permits.

And it does work very nicely on Optus cable.

Roman4604 writes...

If Billion really pushed this aspect in their marketing they could get a decent 'one up' on their competitors.

Hi

The new Billion 7300N supports EWAN, LAN 1 can be configured as a wan port.

www.billion.com/product/...band-router.html
www.billion.com/edu/wireless-N/Demo-7300N

Cheers

Hey guys,why did roman put 0x7 then 0x8 on the wan port and then Bonez put 0x11 then 0x4 on his wan port?

Sorry i cant work that bit out

With this, I notice that it contains pppoe Authentication commands.

Does this allow me to route the VOIP over another router (that handles my Bigpond Cable) ?

kosmo90 writes...

Sorry i cant work that bit out

Because it seems each model (e.g. 7401,7402,7404) uses different vlanmember IDs. My examples were for a 7401 but Bonez was using a 7402.

You just have to find the right ones for your particular unit.

Roman4604 writes...

Telnet your router LAN IP (login same credentials as web) and try these CLI commands ...

transports delete wanlink

port ethernet set p1vlanmember 0x7
port ethernet set p2vlanmember 0x7
port ethernet set p3vlanmember 0x7
port ethernet set p4vlanmember 0x8

port ethernet set vlan enabled

port ethernet set switchreset true

pppoe add transport wanlink dialout eth 1 ethernet1
pppoe set transport wanlink username <username>
pppoe set transport wanlink password <passwd>

ip attach ipwan wanlink

system config save

system restart

NOTE: Only tested on 7401 so may need some adaptation for 7402 (vlanmember ids). Basically it disconnect the logical wan interface from the ADSL port, puts Ethernet port 4 on a seperate VLAN then re-associates wan inf with Ethernet 4 (over which it will do PPPoE).

I've never done any Telneting before but I was hoping to use Roman4604 instructions to enable me to connect my Billion 7401VGP-M (with VoIP enabled) to my 2wire 2071-A modem. At this stage my plan is to use Mac OS X's built in telnet app 'Terminal' in order to access my 7401. In terms of entering the commands, I'm assuming that I need to enter the above sequence of commands individually and hit enter after each one......is this right?

I found the page below instructing how to telnet with terminal. The first section says that in order to login I have to create a new command and type 'slogin user id@computer name'. I know the telnet details for the 7401 are the same as the web access login details, so I'm guessing that 'slogin admin@192.168.1.254' should work given I still have the detault username (but not password)?

http://www.itc.virginia.edu/desktop/mac/secure_telnet/secure_telnet.html

If this works, I will have gotten +2.0 Mbits on my sync speed through attaching a $15 2wire 2071-A modem that I got from eBay to my existing modem-router....nice.

Roman4604 writes...

and try these CLI commands ...

Thats some pretty sweet kit right there Roman4604, nice :)

I always figured this would be possible via the CLI but never took the time to find out.